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[Discussion] What Has Happened [Vent Thread]
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ForeverMourn
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Joined: 10 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lass, I think you made a really good point about how we could be discussing how to prevent/aid in future problems, y0.
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ApotheosisAZ
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Joined: 08 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, since this is the vent thread, I guess it will be ok for me do so as well.

I did lock the Parallax threads upon hearing that there might have been something going on in the game that was inappropriate. Perhaps, if someone else in a position of authority there had "freaked out" and done the same earlier, much of what has occured since then could have been avoided.

I also contacted The Creators immediately. Again, if someone in a postition of authority here in the forums who was aware of any alleged wrongdoing had "freaked out" and done so sooner, then this entire scandal and fiasco might have been avoided.

Say what you will. I blew the whistle the moment I found out that something was amiss. I'd do no differently if it were to do over again.
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bethy
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Joined: 16 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me add that some people are angry...not just because of this particular issue...but of the whole picture and the hypocrisy shown by Ops and other veteran players...including Panda, Falling and Tiger. I think some of you guys are missing that here. This incident was just the "final straw" as it were...there is a lot of anger over the entire way the game has been handled and it is manifesting itself the way it is now as a whole.

I'm not debating the points of what Panda says...some things have been shared with me that give me little sympathy, though. I don't know all the facts....so I'm not going to address them. I feel bad that some of you feel upset...but I think you need to check your own egos here and realize this is how the vast majority of players and lurkers have been feeling for months now.

I'm sorry, Panda...but my violin just isn't big enough. While I won't address stuff I don't know, I will address something you said:

Quote:
I've known about the PM's relationships with some of the female players in this game for a long time.


And yet, you went along it. As a moderator of the game you KNEW stuff was happening that was unethical, and you just let it go. Guess what Panda...that makes you just as guilty as they are. Some of us who had suspicions that there was hanky panky going on could only sit and wait...yeah, it was a badly kept secret because most of you are terrible liars. We may not have known the details, but we knew a lot of you were up to no good....and those who weren't directly participating sat back and let it happen.

As a moderator, you have a responsibility...and you openly admit you knew something was going on that could have an impact on the ethcis of this game and you kept it quiet. I'm sorry, but that's totally inexcusable...and as far as I'm concerned you should be removed from the game completely.

As for Lad, I like him...I know he's done a lot of work, and I totally understand that some of you seem to be blindsided by a few things. But if he was aware of this, too..then...I hold him guilty as well. Albeit slightly less so since he isn't an OP. Anyone who knew this was happening and failed to report it is guilty. But the mods not taking care of it and taking the responsibility make it even more disgusting.
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windsong
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Joined: 12 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont think panda meant "freaked out" in a negative way apo. And I dont think anyone is criticizing the way you handled the situation.

I am very sad and disappointed to return to the forum after being away for a few days to find out that some of the people I respected the most in this game will no longer be a part of it. I am also disappointed in all the scheming and lying that appears to be going on behind the scenes. I use to really enjoy checking the site every day for updates, even though I may not have posted very often or said much. I still enjoyed reading what you all said and getting to know you. I dont think I will be able to get that back, and its a shame.

Thank you for your post Panda, I appreciate it. I feel that I would like to know as much of the truth as possible since I have been involved in the ARG for the past several months.
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Killthesmiley
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Joined: 30 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really appreciate Panda and Sphinx coming back and posting their sides of the story in a rational manner, as Tilt and Fall did.
I think it just enforced was a few of us suspected about certain people in this ordeal.
I applaude their effort and courage. Thanks guys for helping us piece together what ultimately caused this drama and mess.

edited to add: I think the creators need a list of the names named, if ppl haven't already done so. they will definately appreciate them, and the ability to speak with these people. *I am completely not shocked by spinx suggesting one of the names mentioned was a minor, but in the same as stated before in the beginning of the ordeal, disgusted*

edited to also add: i'm going to agree with Bethy to a degree. This whole situation isn't that shocking to some of us, as we've suspected this was going on for a while. And, while I hug you tightly panda, tilt, fall and everyone else who has choosen to come forward, I'm as equally mifted on why moderators them selves didn't come forward with the information. I understand there were friendships, respect, ect ect. but facts are facts and people need to face them. People screwed up, didn't report the issue when it first was noted and people need to own up to it.
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bethy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Killthesmiley wrote:
I really appreciate Panda and Sphinx coming back and posting their sides of the story in a rational manner, as Tilt and Fall did.
I think it just enforced was a few of us suspected about certain people in this ordeal.
I applaude their effort and courage. Thanks guys for helping us piece together what ultimately caused this drama and mess.


I agree with that...although I honestly don't think it makes them unaccountable for what happened. If they knew something was inappropriate, they should have said something long before now. Granted, some of them may not have known it all, but clearly...they knew something.
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Killthesmiley
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bethy wrote:
Killthesmiley wrote:
I really appreciate Panda and Sphinx coming back and posting their sides of the story in a rational manner, as Tilt and Fall did.
I think it just enforced was a few of us suspected about certain people in this ordeal.
I applaude their effort and courage. Thanks guys for helping us piece together what ultimately caused this drama and mess.


I agree with that...although I honestly don't think it makes them unaccountable for what happened. If they knew something was inappropriate, they should have said something long before now. Granted, some of them may not have known it all, but clearly...they knew something.


read what i just edited to say bethy Razz
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robtomorrow
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Joined: 25 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LG15 was founded on a deception, people were upset when the "big decision" turned out to be a deception, now the OpAphid ARG turns out to be full of deception. Why am I not surprised?

I'm not leaving yet, I am still curious of where all this goes, and if I do eventually leave, I won't be making some long pompous statement in the forums. I'll just get bored with it and stop watching.
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MrsCop
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Joined: 31 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sad Panda wrote:
But I'm a believer in karma -- you'll get yours.


werd...
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Onewen
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't expect anyone to care about my opinion...I was just wondering if the PM is now gone, and we've all learned our lesson, why not stay??

Sad Panda and Lad and the others were some of the most interesting parts of the game (*ducks*)...seriously...even when we were all fighting, it was at least interesting.

So sorry if this is a crazy insane post...please forgive me.

This is my first ARG...and those guys were part of it. That's all...((don't shoot me)) Embarassed
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bethy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
read what i just edited to say bethy


Whoops! Laughing



Quote:
I was just wondering if the PM is now gone, and we've all learned our lesson, why not stay??


I don't blame you for asking. It's a fair question. My own personal feeling on the matter is that they shouldn't be allowed to stay (or return) if they knew something was going on with the game. It's a trust issue, and people won't want to participate in a game that is still being moderated or even played by people who have shown to be unethical and abusive with their positions. That includes those who may not have know about the cheaters, but still knew about the ethical issues. This is ESPECIALLY true of one of those issues involved a minor. It's far too easy to lie about your age and find a fake picture...and it's a sticky, dangerous road that has no business in the ARG or the series. Anybody and everybody who had knowledge of this, IMO, should be expelled. It's the only fair thing.

I'm sure there are plenty of other very capable and intelligent people who can resurrect the game. Nobody's indispensable. Besides, for the last few months this game has pretty much sucked anyway...it's no big loss.
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sphinx
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

#1 reason for never coming back is how fallingintosin was treated by many members of this community, after she came forward and revealed something that was extremely difficult for her. The resulting witch hunt, cruel comments, and ignorance in general directed at her was something I never thought in a million years would happen.

I for one am nothing but extremely proud of her.
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Killthesmiley
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the majority are proud of everyone that has come forward.
I think that some of the things being said, as responses are taken a bit out of contex. It's a big confusing situation, so it's understandable why no one i really understanding what everyone else means...but I think Sphinx, Sin, Tilt, Lad and Panda have come out with the clearest form of information and responses yet.
So...I think that something that I said, Lad may have taken as "flaming" when it wasn't, it was just my mind being boggled. I was not trying to insult people, or trying to condem people. My mind is just blown away and boggled, just like so many others on this board.
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bethy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
This is directed at bethy, and those who think like her:

You need to stop acting like you are morally superior to everyone....

So don't deride us for not coming forward sooner in the same breath that you flame us for putting this information out here and effecting Glenn, the game, and LG. You don't have the right. We all know that you have a personal issue with anyone of authority, especially Panda. Any mod would confirm this, if they didn't have to keep a neutral face on because of their position.


Oh, give me a break. My issues with Panda are well documented and the result of her own behavior and inability to effectively moderate. it's not just Panda, either...I've got plenty of examples from ALL of the mods documenting their lack of effective moderation and playing favorites. Need I remind people that SHE was the one who publicly told people to flame her? No, i certainly do not...she just can't take the flames. Clearly..most of you can't...and you're in complete denial. Don't try to put yourself into the role of a victim here...because it's not going to fly. Not with me, and not with a lot of other people who think just like me. I may be a vocal one here...but there are many, many who feel as I do.


Quote:
Let me put it to you this way: if the mods, at the first accusation of misconduct by the PM, immediately called him out then the game would have been over before it began. We loved this game, and felt we were protecting it. Anyone who knew kept quiet out of respect for the game that everyone has been defending on these boards since yesterday. I knew, other people knew, but it always came down to if it was worth jeopardizing the game or not.


Ironically, your keeping quiet had the exact effect your were trying to prevent, only much, much worse. Had you guys spoken up at the first (or even second) sign of misconduct, perhaps things would be different, perhaps not....but we don't know because you guys were too concerned for YOURSELVES that you really weren't thinking of the community as a whole. You never have, and for some time there has been a select group of idividuas trying deperately to entrench themselves deeper into the project.

For example....how many people saw that petition you guys put up demanding a separate forum admin just for the ARG because you didn't like the way BK was handling things? Because you wanted more control. Funny how that petition was signed by a certain select group of people... and that never saw the light of day in the forums here. It was just in the irc chat.

Lad you yourself said you guys did it to get a "feel" from the ARG members...yet you never got the opinion of the majority of people....just those few elitists in the IRC, that clique that has been so hell-bent on keeping secrets.



Can't you guys see why people are so upset???? You all KNEW about this but nobody said anything until it got out of your control..and now look at what YOU'VE done? Some of you had the ability to stop this months ago, but chose not to for your own ego. Shame on you. Shame on all of you who knew and kept it quiet.


Now, again, I'm not going to talk about facts I'm no taware of (and I haven't either) but since some of you brought it up....
If a minor WAS involved...you guys should be held accountable because you had the power to stop it. No game is worth the safety of a child. Not ever.


That being said, I'm glad somebody finally found their balls and came forward about it. I'm glad people are telling their story...but I'll be damned i I'm going to sit back and think some of you are all innocent in this. I understand some of you were surprised by some of the details. I get that , and I applaud you for finally standing your ground. I just question the wisdom of why it took so damn long for you to figure it out. A game is simply not a good enough excuse for somebody's safety or dignity.
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ApotheosisAZ
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2007 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ladron121 wrote:
*We found out that a minor COULD possibly be involved. The person that horcruxes named being one example, the fact that Glenn had shown a pattern of behavior and a good majority of the LG15 fanbase is under 18 years of age being another.


If anyone underage feels they have been the victim of abuse, I urge them to contact their parents or guardian, their school, or the police IMMEDIATELY.

I also recommend that anyone who has evidence of such abuse immediately report it.

I also feel it is my responsibility to point out that NO such reports have reached me, or I would have immediately contacted the proper authorities. I feel confident that The Creators, Administrators, Moderators, Ambassadors, and Operators on this forum would do no less.
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