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Poor Chat Client
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Linc
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Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm a long time veteran of IRC channels.

Basically, we're talking so easy to moderate that it's not even funny. You can implant a Java client about as easy as you can embed a video on the site.

If they want control, it takes about five minutes to read up on IRC chat commands and have it set up to where only certain people with registered and identified nicknames have moderator status (that's the "@" by someone's name). Give that to trusted mods and themselves, and there's no problem.

I know there are plenty of likewise IRC-minded people around, because a lot of them do the "/me runs around" messages. "/me" is an IRC command to signify an action rather than speech (something I'm sure was done for role-players, as it's a very popular medium for online table-top roleplaying).

If it's something they're not familiar with, I can understand why they may be hesitant to do it. But I must stress - this is easier. This is so simple it's not even funny. That's the entire purpose of IRC, and that's why it's been around unchanged since the start of the Internet.

It was made in 1988, and it's been largely untouched since, updated only to keep compatible with changing operating systems (it guarantees to work with Mac, Linux and Windows, from OS/2 to Vista). It's that way for a reason. It works, and impressively so.

I am consistently in awe at how this little sucker can function at such high levels so stable for nearly as long as I've been alive.

While I understand that this adds another division to the site - meaning, now you'll register for the chat (if you require a registered user to be in the channel, which I would suppose to be the case), the comments board, and the forums - I think that this would be worth it. Right now you have a chat that's... let's be generous and say it's functional for groups of less than ten, and about 50% so for those larger than that.

With a Java IRC client embedded into the site (easy stuff to do), it'll be 100% functional, all the time, for as long as the server is working.

Shoot, here, let me show you: http://java.freenode.net/howto.php

Copy and paste the code there to the chat's page on the blog site. Register the #lonelygirl15 channel with the server. Boom. It's done. That's all you do! I'm serious, that's it. You're done, problem solved!

EDIT: If you don't like freenode, here's what you do - find an old computer. I'm talking it could be Windows 95/98 era. Connect it to a stable Internet connection, make a dedicated server. I'm not entirely certain how that's done, but if you really want to have full control, I could probably do this in a week if given the right tools (i.e., power, temporarily, which I know Greg/Miles would be loath to do), max. Probably not even that long.

Hell, I may even have the machine to do it right now. I just need to see if it's working.
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Renegade
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Joined: 24 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

/mode +agreed Renegade


Edit to answer to edit:
Linc wrote:

EDIT: If you don't like freenode, here's what you do - find an old computer. I'm talking it could be Windows 95/98 era. Connect it to a stable Internet connection, make a dedicated server. I'm not entirely certain how that's done, but if you really want to have full control, I could probably do this in a week if given the right tools (i.e., power, temporarily, which I know Greg/Miles would be loath to do), max. Probably not even that long.

Hell, I may even have the machine to do it right now. I just need to see if it's working.

For a business-oriented group, colocation would probably better than plugging it into cable at home (especially since home line upstream usually sucks). And I wouldn't use the word "windows" when talking about servers. But I agree, a small 600/800 Mhz machine, hooked up to a 10 Mbit line in some datacenter...maximum control, stable, should be fine.
Or, if this very server doesn't allow it, upgrade the deal, and install the IRC daemon right here. Would have the added benefit that the faster machine would improve site loading times when a video is posted.

Wikipedia, as usual, has comparison sites for both daemons and services, so selecting isn't hard, either. Just install CentOS, UnrealIRCd, Anope, and done with it.
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TOSG
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Joined: 14 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 6:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ApotheosisAZ wrote:
IRC chat requires a software download; perhaps Java as trainer101 has suggested, or more robust software like mIRC. The present chat does not require a software download.

I am not defending the current configuration either, but there are some other issues to consider besides software.

The chat client must allow The Creators to maintain control of the platform; the present system does allow them to maintain control.

Will a switch to IRC allow them to maintain this control? I would think that if that were the case, they would have already made the switch.


I was going to respond to these points, but I don't think there's anything to add to Linc's great post.

It seems like there is no reason not to make the switch (other than perhaps a learning curve for IRC, but that's really not very steep), and so many reasons to make it.
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Broken Kid
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TOSG wrote:
It seems like there is no reason not to make the switch (other than perhaps a learning curve for IRC, but that's really not very steep), and so many reasons to make it.


I don't know if this is the case, but if the Creators licensed the software that's in use now, it would be one reason they may not want to change.
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milowent
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Broken Kid wrote:
I don't know if this is the case, but if the Creators licensed the software that's in use now, it would be one reason they may not want to change.


with the problems with the chat, which are clearly not being addressed by any software vendor, i question whether they even have a valid license. but that's speculation too.
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Sami
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Joined: 23 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have NEVER EVER gotten in to the chat! Can't we get an official IRC-chat
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giddeanx
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Joined: 01 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am slightly frustrated at the chat myself.

I have only been on it once. I can't get into the lg15 chat for whatever reason. It says to enter blah blah blah to register. I do. It says im already registered. Ok then great where do I put my password and username. So I go log in everywhere I can be lg15 home page, forum, lgpedia. Even logged into flickr and all it says is Namaste. No dice, nada still turned away. This is still better than at home. I don't even get to the "your not registered so register no wait a second you are" screen there.

I am about to kill it and be happy because it will be dead.

Whew slightly frustrated.
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Ziola
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Joined: 17 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TOSG wrote:
It seems like there is no reason not to make the switch (other than perhaps a learning curve for IRC, but that's really not very steep), and so many reasons to make it.

For what its worth, if I can handle IRC, anyone can Laughing
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Killthesmiley
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Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 4732
Location: Halifax NS Canada

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Register the #lonelygirl15 channel with the server. Boom. It's done. That's all you do! I'm serious, that's it. You're done, problem solved!


PS: The lonelygirl15 chat room was register and is now password protected. From what I remember it was under the same group of chat rooms made with the OpAphid IRC


ETA: Scratch that. I am in there now.

eta2: we would need the op's of that room to make other Operators
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Linc
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Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Renegade wrote:
/mode +agreed Renegade


Edit to answer to edit:
Linc wrote:

EDIT: If you don't like freenode, here's what you do - find an old computer. I'm talking it could be Windows 95/98 era. Connect it to a stable Internet connection, make a dedicated server. I'm not entirely certain how that's done, but if you really want to have full control, I could probably do this in a week if given the right tools (i.e., power, temporarily, which I know Greg/Miles would be loath to do), max. Probably not even that long.

Hell, I may even have the machine to do it right now. I just need to see if it's working.

For a business-oriented group, colocation would probably better than plugging it into cable at home (especially since home line upstream usually sucks). And I wouldn't use the word "windows" when talking about servers. But I agree, a small 600/800 Mhz machine, hooked up to a 10 Mbit line in some datacenter...maximum control, stable, should be fine.
Or, if this very server doesn't allow it, upgrade the deal, and install the IRC daemon right here. Would have the added benefit that the faster machine would improve site loading times when a video is posted.

Wikipedia, as usual, has comparison sites for both daemons and services, so selecting isn't hard, either. Just install CentOS, UnrealIRCd, Anope, and done with it.


Right, I was just saying "Win 95/98 era" as an indication of how old it could be.

But, really, I think this is all silliness. Register a channel on a known and protected server, have the on-site Java client automatically send you to that server/channel, and boom, it's done. The time and energy of setting up an IRC server is inputting a lot more work for the same result.

Killthesmiley wrote:
Quote:
Register the #lonelygirl15 channel with the server. Boom. It's done. That's all you do! I'm serious, that's it. You're done, problem solved!


PS: The lonelygirl15 chat room was register and is now password protected. From what I remember it was under the same group of chat rooms made with the OpAphid IRC


ETA: Scratch that. I am in there now.

eta2: we would need the op's of that room to make other Operators


Well, I mean, worse case scenario if we can't get a hold of the Operators we just go to another server.
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Sami
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Joined: 23 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Register the #lonelygirl15 channel with the server. Boom. It's done. That's all you do! I'm serious, that's it. You're done, problem solved!


But will the characters log on there when they're chatting?
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milowent
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the last times i have darted into the official chat, its pretty much a ghost town (10 or less) compared to a few months ago before the chat down period. there is clearly a demand not being met.

it sounds like #lonelygirl15 is already running and accessible?

BOY, this COTTon is soft.
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TOSG
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Broken Kid wrote:
TOSG wrote:
It seems like there is no reason not to make the switch (other than perhaps a learning curve for IRC, but that's really not very steep), and so many reasons to make it.


I don't know if this is the case, but if the Creators licensed the software that's in use now, it would be one reason they may not want to change.


Gotcha. Not a very good one, though: the licensing money is gone either way, so they should just cut their losses.

In psychology, they call this a sacrifice trap - "a decision-making process whereby individuals escalate their commitment to a previously chosen, though failing, course of action in order to justify or 'make good on' prior investments."
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Killthesmiley
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Joined: 30 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
BOY, this COTTon is soft.


#lonelygirl15
#maddison
#hymnofone
and
#outofgame
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kelly

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dixiemccoy
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Joined: 12 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Broken Kid wrote:
I don't know if this is the case, but if the Creators licensed the software that's in use now, it would be one reason they may not want to change.


If the public price is what they paid, it is a $349 boondoggle. Flash Community Video Chat has shown some pretty significant issues with the fans.

IRC has several servers and a metric buttload of clients that are absolutely free. No need to send good money after bad. And I'm pretty sure there are fans out there who would be willing to configure it...

The only thing it has that might be a bit more difficult in IRC is the user authentication against the WordPress login used on the web site. You could get past that with running your own IRC server. The age of the protocol makes it a very low-processor application on the server and the text-only interface keeps bandwidth low, even for large numbers of users.
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