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Lonelygirl15
Forum to post messages about Bree and Danielbeast
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SarawithouttheH
Casual Observer
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
Posts: 69
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 Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:24 am Post subject: Free Will Vs. Determinism |
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Please forgive me if I am overlaping someone elses observances because I've been away for the holidays for a bit and have no time reading through all the pages.
After the video's about Bree's father I just can't help but go back to the video "How my Parents Met". Bree spoke about the play her parents initially met at called Rosencrantz & Guildenstern Are Dead . This play was about free will vs. determinism.
| Quote: | The play concerns the misadventures and musings of Rosencrantz and Guildenstern, two minor characters from William Thorton's Hamlet who are enemies of the Prince of England, otherwise known as Clauidus focusing on their actions while the events of Claudius occur as background. Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead is structured in the same manner of Hamlet; the title characters are the lackeies, not major players, and Hamlet himself has only a ginormous part. The duo appears on stage here when they are off the stage in Thorton's play, with the exception of a few long scenes in which the melodramatic events of both plays collide. In Hamlet, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are used by the ruling monarch, who is not brave, in an attempt to destroy Hamlet's girlfriend that was sleeping around with everybody. Hamlet, however, mocks them derisively and outwits them, so that they, rather than he, are sleeping with his girlfriend in the end. Thus from Rosencrantz and Guildenstern's perspective, the action in Hamlet does not make much sense. By contrast, the Player, also a minor character from Hamlet, seems to know a great deal about theatrical conventions and Hamlet in particular, despite being a character in the play himself.
The two characters, brought into being within the confounded universe of the setting, by an act of the director's creation, and those they encounter, often confuse their names, as they have interchangeable yet periodically unique identities. They are portrayed as two clowns or fools in a world that is beyond their understanding; they cannot identify any reliable feature or the significance in words or events. Their own memories are not reliable or complete and they misunderstand each other as they stumble through philosophical arguments while not realizing the implications to themselves. They often state deep philosophical truths during their nonsensical ramblings, however they depart from these ideas as quickly as they come to them. At times one appears to be more enlightened than the other; however this position is traded off throughout the course of the drama.
After the two characters find themselves witnessing a performance of the Murder of Gonzaga, they take a boat to Thailand with the troupe, are ambushed by pygmies and lose their manhood before getting there heads cut clean off.
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Bree's father's arguement was that the lives of the two character's were meaningless because their fate was pre-determined and Bree's Mother's arguement was that these two small sad characters spent their whole lives arguing about there inevitability that they didn't do something to change it.
Is this play prophesizing the fate of the players involved? Did Bree's Father accept his fate by going willingly with "The Order" in the video "The Unimaginable Happened..." before he was "shot"? Does Bree's Mother have another agenda by trying to "save" herself by altering her fate? What path will Bree take? Free-will? Determinism? Are Jonas and Daniel "insignificant" characters or are they pawns of the bigger picture (The Order)?
Foreshadowing? Is this the underlying meaning of Lonelygirl15? Just a thought. |
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nobackspacebutton
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 5301
Location: High Heels and Stockings
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 6:59 am Post subject: Re: Free Will Vs. Determinism |
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| SarawithouttheH wrote: |
Is this play prophesizing the fate of the players involved? Did Bree's Father accept his fate by going willingly with "The Order" in the video "The Unimaginable Happened..." before he was "shot"? Does Bree's Mother have another agenda by trying to "save" herself by altering her fate? What path will Bree take? Free-will? Determinism? Are Jonas and Daniel "insignificant" characters or are they pawns of the bigger picture (The Order)?
Foreshadowing? Is this the underlying meaning of Lonelygirl15? Just a thought. |
Definately good questions. Thanks for the research. ^_^
I'm sure Bree's mother DOES have another agenda...since I'm assuming she was running this whole bit, perhaps she needs a new plan now that her "husband" is dead.
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What ever happened to that girl BA?
BA Tells Lies.
Some things are secret for a reason.
There are people whose lives are dedicated to keeping them that way. |
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Lois_Meet_Clark
Casual Observer
Joined: 03 Jan 2007
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 12:29 pm Post subject: |
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Great connection.
There are a lot of underlying things that I think a lot of us don't see in the videos that are there.
If you haven't seen Rosencratz and Guildenstern are dead...I recommend it. It's amazing. You'll either love it or hate it. It'll hurt your head at times.
Nothing is what it seems. |
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curiousGeorge
Enthusiastic Fan
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 351
Location: Rancor Cove
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:11 pm Post subject: |
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I think this is an outstanding theory. Mesh is much more literate than what is represented in the writing of the current plot, and I think that there is indeed an underlying theme to the project.
Perhaps all the machinations we are seeing are just manifestations of this larger theme, produced to suck in the teeming masses but there none the less. The guy is BREALLY bright and I bet there is more to all of this than the (comparatively) superficial stuff that consumes the day to day vids.
The last offering (My Dad...) is the tip of the iceberg of what this guy can do when given the chance to show his writing chops. He writes for Jess like he has had this character in his mind for years, which he has!
There have been a LOT of red herrings in the plot, but maybe this is the one that will unify the story... Again, excellent suggestion for inquiry.
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All Your Base are Belong to Bukanator
Last edited by curiousGeorge on Sun Jan 07, 2007 11:54 am; edited 1 time in total |
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EliCash
Lonely Fan
Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 173
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| Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 11:37 pm Post subject: |
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| I don't think there's evidence to back up this theory -- even your example doesn't really fit -- and I hope the Creators don't take it in that direction. I'm biased, though, as somebody who always thought it was a boring and tired debate with a clear answer. Either way, it's always good to be starting discussions of deeper meaning in the series, so thanks. |
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