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Lonelygirl15
Forum to post messages about Bree and Danielbeast
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 Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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| curiousGeorge wrote: | | Yeah, well I didn't want to open any wounds by bringing those inconsistencies up at that same time. This is ENOUGH of a problem to address on it's own. |
True. And this really is the only one that will be an ongoing headscratcher.
| curiousGeorge wrote: | As for the strangling,  . Kinda harsh but I know you were just making a point.  |
Yeah, but there's been a few times that if I were Daniel, I swear to God...
| curiousGeorge wrote: | This is indeed my pet peeve logic flaw and it has just taken a turn for the worse. I think that if the writers had been more clever, this could have worked out this ahead of time and have it make sense. Not sure how, but then again I did not paint them in this logical corner. They did.  |
True enough. And I guess I can understand that this is your pet peeve. We've all got one. I really can't offer you a way to fix it, though.
No matter what Bree and Daniel could or couldn't see (or what Op could or couldn't see at the beginning), they've still made horrible decisions by posting all that they have (and continuing to). Really, I think I'm just going to conclude that they've had about 115 lapses in good judgment. |
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curiousGeorge
Enthusiastic Fan
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 351
Location: Rancor Cove
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| Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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Oh well, I don't really want to go through five pages of this again to just go around in circles with this thing. I AM very disappointed that they don't seem to pay attention to all these kind of things, it make it very distracting to me to try and keep this straight.
I just wish they could have found this vid in the van (on a memory stick or the like) and we wouldn't even have to even pursue this. As lame as that sounds, it would be more "realistic" than this may play out to be DTFR.
I realize that they have a small staff and are short on funds, this just seems like such a glaring flaw to me... But then again, I can't solve all those cool ARG puzzles and am left to puzzle this stuff. 
You all are welcome to try and explain this away, I just can't see any possible way to do this without some kind of solution at the "meta" level. I guess we will have to wait and see what happens. 
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robtomorrow
Devoted Fan
Joined: 25 Sep 2006
Posts: 849
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 7:59 pm Post subject: Re: Who Can "See" "What" "Where&quo |
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| curiousGeorge wrote: | Here we go again boyz and girlz.
Now that Op is releasing videos that are to be viewed by Bree and Joan, the reciprocal must be true.
And yes, I read the latest post from Miles and it does NOT address this logical based issue. There is no way that this can be done at this point.
Sooooo, every video released by Bree and Jonas must now be able to be viewed by the Order and vice-versa. This is going to be very difficult to pull off with ANY sense of logic. You can't have this as a one-way street at this point, it is a complete logical fallacy. No amount of fanwanking can resolve this issue.
As such, Bree and Jonas will knowingly reveal all of their plans. Nothing is a secret from the Order and vice-versa.
This does not make any sense.  |
I made that same point when they first announced that OpAphid is canon, this question has been a problem ever since.
As I've posted before the general rule I use is,
One character can see another characters videos when it is convenient to the plot and cannot when it is inconvenient to the plot.
Although with this latest video it complicates the question to a point where I am not sure if even that rule works anymore. Otherwise I agree with Spacie, It has become impossible to make any real sense of the series, or to take it too seriously. |
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The Creators
Site Admin
Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 172
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| Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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curiousGeorge et al.,
I want to broadly address your concerns:
1) We think about the logic of "posting videos on the internet," "who sees what," and "the video blog format" constantly... obsessively.
2) Right now we are limited technologically by the website. Either we post in the video comment section where the videos remain "unseen" until we have the characters deem that they've "seen it," or we post it in the main feed on the left and all the characters see it.
3) So... right now where are we at? OpAphid is watching Bree/Jonas/Daniel/Gemma videos. Bree/Jonas/Daniel are (as of today) watching OpAphid videos. We will do our best to stick within this logic structure and you will see how it impacts the plot.
4) Moving forward we will have technological solutions coupled to story rationalizations to allow us to have "public" and "private" video feeds. This will allow for more storytelling flexibility.
Hope this addresses your concerns.
The Creators |
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Claramata
Casual Observer
Joined: 20 Nov 2006
Posts: 52
Location: New Jersey
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| Posted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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I guess that this audience has lost their ablity to suspend their disbelief and go with the story.
Is that the creator's fault, or our own?
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curiousGeorge
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Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 351
Location: Rancor Cove
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| Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 6:27 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for responding. I can't imagine how challenging it must be to keep this in a logical structure and yet incorporate all the disparate elements into a "whole". Tough stuff... and never been done before, AFAIK.
As for suspension of disbelief, I will restate another point. The best works of fiction (books, film, TV, video games) allow the end-user to be so completely absorbed in the story that this SOD is not an effort at all. It's easy to just "go with it" and enjoy it. These sudden changes in POV are just so jarring, it's like the reality of the Breeniverse keeps getting flipped on it's head and the logic path needed to maintain a SOD accordingly.
I am aware that there are behind-the-scenes and larger story arc issues that may drive these radical changes. That said, I appreciate your comments and am looking forward to seeing how you pull this off. Thanks again.
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voyboy
Thor's Hammer
Joined: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 1011
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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I am so pickey about continuity in films and TV. Im one of those people that people say, "Dont go to the movies with him cause all he'll do is ruin it for you"
Yet, this doesnt bother me. I've always played it in my mind that us fans have private access to Bree, DB, Gemma, Jonas, vids, and vice versa. Same goes with 'how' they uploaded a video, or 'who' shot it. I really dont care.
I am obviously in the minority here. Should I be caring about it being true to a vlog? What am I missing out on if I do?
(and by the way I am not being a smart ass, I want to know what it is that I am obvioulsy being stupid about.)
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Lurker
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| Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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| The Creators wrote: | | 2) Right now we are limited technologically by the website. Either we post in the video comment section where the videos remain "unseen" until we have the characters deem that they've "seen it," or we post it in the main feed on the left and all the characters see it. |
Hi, guys. Thanks for replying to our concerns.
I'm not sure I understand exactly what you mean by this right above, but I know you've had to struggle with the format of this series all along. I imagine there's a lot of things you've wanted to try that just didn't mesh with that format realistically (though at times I think you've wanted to do it bad enough that you've gone ahead, like with "Bree's Dad Is Dead"; by the way, as I've said elsewhere, though it wasn't logical from an in-universe perspective, it was directed and edited very well; great job).
The real limitation, though, is that the format of the series requires that Bree and her friends can't do the smart thing or make a move without their enemies being aware of it since the series can't move ahead without uploading the videos. The smart thing would have obviously been for them to stop making videos way back in September. Of course, had that happened, there'd be no series today.
I'm interested in your opinion of the logic of this particular aspect of things. Have the characters ever offered reasoning for why they continue uploading their videos (in the in-character section of the forum, I mean)? I know that the real reason the videos continue being uploaded is because this is a fictional series and vlogging is the series' format, but from an in-universe perspective, can you share with us the characters' rationale?
| The Creators wrote: | | 3) So... right now where are we at? OpAphid is watching Bree/Jonas/Daniel/Gemma videos. Bree/Jonas/Daniel are (as of today) watching OpAphid videos. We will do our best to stick within this logic structure and you will see how it impacts the plot. |
Have you worked out -- and, if so, can you share it with us -- which of OpAphid's older videos were visible to the main characters, which were intended solely for the real-life audience, and for how long OpAphid has known of Bree's stuff?
| The Creators wrote: | | 4) Moving forward we will have technological solutions coupled to story rationalizations to allow us to have "public" and "private" video feeds. This will allow for more storytelling flexibility. |
By this do you mean doing something like making videos that only OpAphid's real-life "followers" can see, and which they would then have to pass on to the rest of us on out-of-universe terms?
| voyboy wrote: | I am obviously in the minority here. Should I be caring about it being true to a vlog? What am I missing out on if I do?
(and by the way I am not being a smart ass, I want to know what it is that I am obvioulsy being stupid about.) |
I don't think you're being stupid, but in terms of logical behavior (not so much continuity, really) there's a concern to be had. The crux of this whole line of curiosity is really "Why would Bree, Daniel, and Jonas upload videos at all, either in the past or now?" Obviously the videos could have only ever been used to their detriment. They gave away their plans, their locations, and -- in Daniel's case especially -- incriminated themselves for multiple crimes.
Closer to terms of continuity, perhaps (though it's still more of a logic question), is the question of who could see OpAphid's videos (Bree & friends, or just us). |
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